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 Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)

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Cyprix



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PostSubject: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 00:57

DPS Rotation goes as followed:
1) Cast Wrath until you proc Eclipse
2) Cast Starfire for duration of Eclipse (15s)
3) Cast Insect Swarm & Moonfire at beginning of Eclipse Cooldown
4) Cast Starfire a few times leaving room before Eclipse cooldown is over to:
5) Cast Insect Swarm & Moonfire just before Eclipse Cooldown ends

Glyphs
~Major~
[Glyph of Moonfire]
[Glyph of Starfire]
or
[Glyph of Insect Swarm]
~Minor~
[Glyph of Unburdened Rebirth]

[New Build] - You can go 56/0/5 or go deep 61/0/0 Honestly i think the build i have is the best build for 70.
http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=11&tal=5012203125331303213305301031000000000000000000000000000000005000000000000000000000000


Last edited by Cyprix on September 26th 2009, 04:14; edited 2 times in total
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emooplum



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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 02:13

lol i love typhoon..not to make anyone angry. Twisted Evil
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 03:44

I do not know much about moonkins but I am pretty certain Nature's Focus is crap. Not only will you rarely be taking damage of the sort, it does not affect Starfire nor even Hurricane, at all. Restoration druids themselves only pick it up as filler.

Improved Faerie Fire on the other hand is one of the biggest raid-buffs a Balance druid has. I would take the 3 talent points out of Nature's Focus and put them in this. The other option I could see is Dreamstate. I am completely unaware whether if Balance druids still have mana issues, but Dreamstate is to Balance more or less as Intensity is to Restoration druids. I would think you would have many mana issues without it.



I would like some clarification on the rotation, part. Eclipse has independent 30 second cooldowns for both the Wrath and Starfire procs. Were you trying to say that the best one and the one we should be shooting for is the one which buffs Starfire? It seems as if those 3 starfires you use to wait for the cd of its Eclipse buff would proc the Wrath Eclipse and you would basically just be rotating back and forth between each of them and line up cds/trinkets with the Starfire Eclipse. Does that sound right?



Typhoon has its uses but I do not see many extra talent points you could easily justify in picking it up for. If you do decide to keep it, glyph for it. Else you would be using it at the inconvenience of others.

This brings me to another question: what are the best glyphs for moonkins?

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Cyprix



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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 03:58

Sorry haha i goofed lemme Redit.
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 04:23

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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 04:51

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Cyprix



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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 04:53

kumo wrote:
I do not know much about moonkins but I am pretty certain Nature's Focus is crap. Not only will you rarely be taking damage of the sort, it does not affect Starfire nor even Hurricane, at all. Restoration druids themselves only pick it up as filler.

Improved Faerie Fire on the other hand is one of the biggest raid-buffs a Balance druid has. I would take the 3 talent points out of Nature's Focus and put them in this. The other option I could see is Dreamstate. I am completely unaware whether if Balance druids still have mana issues, but Dreamstate is to Balance more or less as Intensity is to Restoration druids. I would think you would have many mana issues without it.

I messed up and i fixed the tree.

Quote :
I would like some clarification on the rotation, part. Eclipse has independent 30 second cooldowns for both the Wrath and Starfire procs. Were you trying to say that the best one and the one we should be shooting for is the one which buffs Starfire? It seems as if those 3 starfires you use to wait for the cd of its Eclipse buff would proc the Wrath Eclipse and you would basically just be rotating back and forth between each of them and line up cds/trinkets with the Starfire Eclipse. Does that sound right?

No Boomchickens only have a 30sec rotation once the wrath Eclipse procs to start firing Starfires. Yeah you dont want to be casting Starfire just so you can get the eclipse to cast wraths. Starfires cost less mana and do alot more damage. your main goal is to cast as many starfires as you can.

Quote :
Typhoon has its uses but I do not see many extra talent points you could easily justify in picking it up for. If you do decide to keep it, glyph for it. Else you would be using it at the inconvenience of others.

its rubbish, its a pvp spell

Quote :
This brings me to another question: what are the best glyphs for moonkins?

I have listed some Glyphs above
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 05:33

emooplum wrote:
I beg the differ i just went from 1466dps to 1690 dps from this spec

http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=11&tal=5032003125031303213005301030000000000000000000000000000000205003002000000000000000000


I really do not like that you have to drop Improved Faerie Fire to get Master Shapeshifter. It is one of those raid essential abilities and it provides a good buff to your own damage as well. You basically have to give up 5 talents points of filler to get 2 talent points of something that's pretty good. You lose out on 3 quite essential talent points and 3 other talent points which are quite good (I would think haste is quite useful for moonkins).

5 filler + 2 good VS 3 essential + 3 okay + 1 extra.

OR

4% +spell power VS 3% crit/hit + 3% haste + Starfall


Even if you just gained a general dps increase there, and I find that slightly hard to believe because starfall is easy "free" damage, how you perform with your current gear and spec is not necessarily the same way you will perform in full BiS gear. I would think Starfall alone would outweigh the 4% SP in the long run.

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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 11:14

im sorry it was 1466dps.. to.. 2k dps i broke it last night with my dummie.. im just saying as of right now crappy gear.. in the long run maybe not but when im vs bosses i'll be able to help my single dps on a BOSS, i dont mind the trash dps. Im talking about Boss Dps.
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 26th 2009, 16:46

emooplum wrote:
im sorry it was 1466dps.. to.. 2k dps i broke it last night with my dummie.. im just saying as of right now crappy gear.. in the long run maybe not but when im vs bosses i'll be able to help my single dps on a BOSS, i dont mind the trash dps. Im talking about Boss Dps.

Sorry but you did not gain 600 DPS from a %4 damage increase thats just not going to happen. The only reason why a boomkin should be in the resto tree is if your level 80. Only reason Furor has 5 points in it is because 10% intell is > 5% in genisis. We do to many AOE pulls for a boomkin to not have Starfall.
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 29th 2009, 12:13

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#0tMbuiIscdIAhou:urZz (59/0/0+2) is currently the best build for pure dps at 70. If you really wanted to maximize your dps you would put remaining two points in furor, but they aren't that huge of a deal, and a point in typhoon or two points in gale winds for aoe pulls are perfectly fine alternatives. Even two points in bramble for tank buffing doesn't hurt. I like to save starfall for my first starfire eclipse because it gives you practically 100% nature's grace uptime, and starfire benefits much more than wrath because wrath is often under the gcd with nature's grace and sunwell haste gear. If wrath isn't under the GCD during nature's grace, you can use it during a wrath ecplise instead because starfire crit chance during starfire eclipse already increases NG uptime significantly. Coordinate with your shaman when heroism will be used and pop your trees right before that so that they get the benefit of the increased attack speed from them.

If you're wondering about owlkin frenzy, it currently procs off of a solid majority of all level 70 boss aoes, and ends up being a significant boost to both longevity and dps.

I've been thinking about applying to this guild and xferring for a while. I played a balance druid in BC who i deleted when i thought I had quit forever and am now coming back to druids but alreayd have a warlock at 80 clearing current 25 man heroic content, and it seems like it would be fun to have a toon to do the 70 raids i remember so fondly. However, I don't know if the druid officers don't even know how to play their classes, and don't want to spend time dealing with people that don't know what they're doing. Things at 70 are identical to dpsing at 80 - there is no difference at this level except for slightly worse scaling due to a lack of talent points and master shapeshifter. From EJ:

Quote :
The Eclipse Rotation

You will generally operate in a four-step cycle.
1.Pre-Lunar. Cast Wrath until the Eclipse buff appears (have some mod that will make it very obvious when you gain the buff).
2.Lunar Eclipse. When you see the buff, finish casting your current Wrath and then cast Starfire for the duration of Eclipse.
3.Pre-Solar. When Eclipse fades, continue casting Starfire. Note that a Starfire only gains the benefit if it is fully completed while the Eclipse buff is up, so if you only have time for a partial cast, your Eclipse is effectively over (but you should be using a macro or mod to try to go directly from Lunar to Solar, see below). Cast Starfire until the Eclipse buff appears.
4.Solar Eclipse. Cast Wrath for the duration. Continue casting when it ends to loop back around into step 1.


DoTs

Against a single target, reapply MF and IS whenever they drop. MF should have higher priority for reapplication, but the difference is tiny. During a Wrath-heavy part of the cycle, it may be best to reapply MF last (after IS or other instants) to minimize the chance that it will drop before you cast SF again.

There's currently a slight open question about whether it's worth waiting until Eclipse ends if a DoT expires in the final few seconds Eclipse. This is hard to model and the DPS difference is very small, so consider it a matter of personal taste for the moment.


I'm curious what YOUR sources for your apparently made-up rotation are, Cyprix? Your hostile attitude trying to force your own uniformed opionion on other less informed people really deters someone who is considering joining a guild, especially considering your position here. Additionally, you're harming the people who you are misinforming in that you are distorting their initial understanding of the class, which is perhaps the most important when it comes to long term understanding in a more important raid environment.

If you are planning on armorying me in an attempt to find some way to distract attention from the points I've made, my spec is not the highest dps spec at the moment. I haven't respecced yet.
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 29th 2009, 19:57

Where in the world did you get hostile lol? all i said was that he did not get 600 dps increase from a %4 Master shapeshifter talent.

Quote :
You can go 56/0/5 or go deep 61/0/0 Honestly I THINK the build i have is the best build for 70.

Judgeing by the fact that i said i Think its the best doesnt mean it is, So Please learn to read.

My source is from Delia Since Premonition is #1 World Rank at the moment i think thats a pretty good source.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sen%27jin&n=Delia

kthxbye
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 30th 2009, 02:22

drooba wrote:

I've been thinking about applying to this guild and xferring for a while. I played a balance druid in BC who i deleted when i thought I had quit forever and am now coming back to druids but alreayd have a warlock at 80 clearing current 25 man heroic content, and it seems like it would be fun to have a toon to do the 70 raids i remember so fondly. However, I don't know if the druid officers don't even know how to play their classes, and don't want to spend time dealing with people that don't know what they're doing. Things at 70 are identical to dpsing at 80 - there is no difference at this level except for slightly worse scaling due to a lack of talent points and master shapeshifter. From EJ:

Hello Drooba, thanks for your post.

I feel as if part of your disappointment in what you have found in this thread (or these forums) lie in that you made unnecessary assumptions. This guild does not operate under an arbitrary caste system of 'class officers' and although for some class/specs their play-style and function do perform similarly at 80 (and in some cases, even TBC pre 3.0), many do not in the slightest. An obvious example are Restoration Druids. We do not have Nourish at 70 and with the constant changes to Lifebloom it is no longer our most efficient spam-able healing spell. This forces us to create a play style quite different from anything Restoration Druids in the past or present at 80 utilize. So forgive me if I seem to be jousting your criticism but it seems you yet have much to grasp as well.

Something which is less obvious to some is that there are no longer level-70 theory crafters. If you had not yet noticed, Drooba, Insurrection is the only North American TBC guild performing at our scale. For all I know (though I imagine it to be unlikely) there are no others in Europe or the rest of the world, either. So you see, we are much left to ourselves to figure out things on our own. There is only so much we can take from the EJ forums and apply to our raids; we are in a sense, our own theory crafters.

Unfortunately, not everyone in our guild is as knowledgeable as you are yourself. We have a huge variety, including first time raiders (as in EVER) and players who main 80s completing server first achievements. As it turns out, we do not have an experienced Moonkin in the guild, and this is what this thread is for: This is our 70 moonkin discussion thread.

If you are interested in checking out this guild, feel free to apply in the recruitment thread. Also, if you have any more constructive feedback on "how to moonkin" at 70, that would be great as well. That bit about Owlkin Frenzy is very good news indeed and not some thing I was aware of. Hope to hear from you again.

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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 30th 2009, 11:18

Trust me, I've noticed that you're the only active and successful 70 TBC raiding guild. I've been looking for all the ones I can find and you guys are without question the best looking group of people I've been able to find. I didn't realize how the inter-class rankings worked, also - mea culpa. Well, I can see that the assumptions I made were, in fact, incorrect. I realize that people in high end raiding guilds either use difference specs depending on longevity required, damage requierd, and farm status on relevent content. In your credit; for fights where mana conservation is a concern, I have found that only wrathing to proc starfire ecplise and only using starfire and moonfire (insect swarm is another viable option, but I've found that moonfire, even with its greater mana cost, combined with MF + SF glyph is a more efficient option) is a good way to conserve mana while only losing 500-600 dps on the target dummy. It does make greater use of 4t6, starfire glyph, and moonfire glyph, which helps negate some of the theoretical dps loss. I personally am working on rt6 + 4t5, as it looks very promising. It wasn't THE BEST in TBC because of scaling problems, but I believe with the new epic gems and professions, that will be somewhat less of a problem now and it might even edge out ahead for pure damage:mana efficiency. I didn't realize it before, but I could probably even run some simcraft on the issue; up until now it completely slipped my mind that I could even use that for level 70 calculations. I'll stay active here until I manage to apply (I'm waiting to get more gear; I know I can perform fine but I figure its better for you guys if I get accepted that I come in only needing a few pieces rather than needing half of the things from every boss.)
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PostSubject: Re: Boomkin PVE Spec (NO TYPHOON!)   September 30th 2009, 13:18

Feel free to apply and join us sooner. Gearing up is part of the fun! It is not like we see new content regularly. Razz

I will admit that everyone in our moonkin-department is pretty far behind in gear at the moment. Our best geared druids all ended up as resto, somehow.

I would also like to emphasize that Insurrection is more so about being a community of those interested in 70 content. So even if perhaps you might have a bit more competition for gear, you may enjoy all the extra opportunities you will have available here on Korgath.

I will be looking forward to seeing your application.

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